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Re: Trail clearing this weekend Apr 9/10

PostPosted: Fri Apr 08, 2011 3:24 pm
by jswanson
Wish I could be there, but I'll be at a baseball tournament for 6 year old kids. I can't believe they have invitational tournaments for 6 year olds. :roll:

Re: Trail clearing this weekend Apr 9/10

PostPosted: Fri Apr 08, 2011 3:26 pm
by Busta Move
Thanks, Mark. We'll be riding in because there is a lot of trail between the downed trees.

I will be there and ready to roll out at 8 AM. If you have some sturdy gloves and some type of cutters (machete or small, sharp pruners), we're hoping to cut back or pull up some of the encroaching privet while we are out there.

Thanks for helping!!

JOE: WEAK!!!

Re: Trail clearing this weekend Apr 9/10

PostPosted: Fri Apr 08, 2011 3:34 pm
by Larry D
John you gotta cut Joe some slack. He still has burns from his spiffy new apron straps.

Re: Trail clearing this weekend Apr 9/10

PostPosted: Fri Apr 08, 2011 4:10 pm
by rich_k
Dan (the man) and Rich K will roll out from the Germantown trailhead at 8 am with two chainsaws (Saturday). John's (Busta) got the WG side covered but we'll need help on our side. So please come out. Small pruning saws, clippers, and chainsaws welcome. We'll be riding in on Yellow until we meet the other team, then hit Blue.

Suggestion: Long pants and sturdy shoes (see the posts w/ pictures of copperheads and there's always poison ivy).

I will bring some water bottles. Maybe some other type of beverage...

Re: Trail clearing this weekend Apr 9/10

PostPosted: Fri Apr 08, 2011 4:48 pm
by jswanson
Larry D wrote:John you gotta cut Joe some slack. He still has burns from his spiffy new apron straps.


Yes, the ones she used on me last night :shock:

Re: Trail clearing this weekend Apr 9/10

PostPosted: Fri Apr 08, 2011 7:09 pm
by dantheman
MorrisM wrote:
Brad C wrote:
OutCast wrote:I have a Husky 3120 Rancher (chainsaw) with a 36 inch blade and that tree would still be serious work. A team will be a couple of hours on that bad boy.

The big tree may be best done as a separate project on Sunday. We could get Outcast together with Steve K. with their big saws and clear the trail.
The great big tree up near the greenline may need to be a similar group project with the big saws.


I vote for BIG saws. I can help on Sunday.


I vote for no big saws! Sorry guys,don't mean to be the one to disagree but why not make a reroute around it and then still leave a tree ramp(3' tall and by the time anyone got hurt on it, it will have sunk some). No one seems to have a concern with the tree ramp just off the goat because of the ability to simply go around it with a beginner line right next to it. I see this as a perfect opportunity to increase the trail features for one of the user groups that never has a say in the trail,the experienced mtber. They should be considered as well as every other trail user. How will anyone ever become better without challenging themselves? Plus, I don't know of any trail rider that can't simply ride over that tree ramp off the goat,its not a giant jump or obstacle. If the corcern is that MSTA will be liable then MSTA doesn't have to build it,just simply don't cut it. It will get built before long by the ghosts or someone I'm sure. I fully understand where Brad and Morris are coming from but I think were are a little saw happy.The park has a full NBL BMX race track that the average cyclist can not tackle,whats wrong with having a trail that accomodates any level of trail riding,even hikers and runners,then the Horsies can have a rerouted trail right next to the ramp. Hope this doesn't start a big arguement..Just sayin is all.

Re: Trail clearing this weekend Apr 9/10

PostPosted: Fri Apr 08, 2011 7:22 pm
by Brad C
Keep in mind there is a big difference between the public trails and the BMX track. The BMX association leases that space from the park. They pay rent. That is why they have a lock on the gate. Anyone who goes in there has to climb the fence and under the law is trespassing. That makes a big difference in liability issues.

And by the way, even discussing building obstacles on this forum automatically involves MSTA. Any first year law student would get an injunction to have our internet host freeze the forum so entries could not be deleted. My computer would probably be seized for evidence too.

We have way too many lawyers.

Re: Trail clearing this weekend Apr 9/10

PostPosted: Fri Apr 08, 2011 7:24 pm
by rich_k
Log ramp, goooood!

Re: Trail clearing this weekend Apr 9/10

PostPosted: Fri Apr 08, 2011 7:42 pm
by OutCast
I took photos of all the down trees yesterday but forgot to post them.

Was riding the yellow from GT towards WG earlier today and looks like someone took this

Image

and did this:

Image

totally got rid of this, it's completely gone now.

Image

and this:

Image

now looks like this:

Image

Good job, whoever.

Re: Trail clearing this weekend Apr 9/10

PostPosted: Fri Apr 08, 2011 7:43 pm
by Brad C
Dan, thanks for taking care of the bookkeeping on the WRT clearing.

The volunteer numbers help the MTB community in trail negotiations and help the park in grant applications. The more the MTB community can show volunteer efforts, the better position we have in trail access decisions. The better the park can show a strong volunteer base, the higher they rank when grant decisions are made. It's a win-win.

Looks like there is some hefty work ahead. Good "before" pictures. Someone get some "after" pictures. Earth Day is coming up 4/17, some recent before/after pictures would look good on our table.

Re: Trail clearing this weekend Apr 9/10

PostPosted: Fri Apr 08, 2011 7:55 pm
by OutCast
I've got "before" photos of 22 trees that are laying across the trails and after the guys get done doing whatever they're going to do to the trails this weekend I'll pop off "after" photos and make a post with the links of all sets. (before after)

Yeah those "after photos" above were from some guy's cell phone, not quite 18MP lol

Edit: I misspelled they're.

Re: Trail clearing this weekend Apr 9/10

PostPosted: Fri Apr 08, 2011 8:00 pm
by dantheman
Brad C wrote:Keep in mind there is a big difference between the public trails and the BMX track. The BMX association leases that space from the park. They pay rent. That is why they have a lock on the gate. Anyone who goes in there has to climb the fence and under the law is trespassing. That makes a big difference in liability issues.

And by the way, even discussing building obstacles on this forum automatically involves MSTA. Any first year law student would get an injunction to have our internet host freeze the forum so entries could not be deleted. My computer would probably be seized for evidence too.

We have way too many lawyers.
Understandable and good point,But would a 3' ride-over be an issue? If someone sues over that on a mtb trail then thats just stupid. Mtbing is an action sport. Would maybe some ride at your own risk signs at the entrances be an issue? How do other trails go about having obstacles? if there is clearly 2 ways to go and you choose to take the harder route and hurt yourself then that should be your own fault.Not a lawyer but theres gotta be a way to include every skill level,legally,in a trail system. Out of all the local trails we don't have hardly anything for the rider that enjoys riding obstacles or jumps,that needs to change. It doesn't even have to be WRT, I enjoy building and riding those kinds of stuff as well as alot of others, but there is nowhere to do it. I would happily go build anywhere I was given permission,and would fund my own projects with my own hard earned money,Just need the place.
After reading this I know what your gonna say,Brad,''Its not really a MTB trail'' so I rest my case. I have a dream that there can be an awesome,flowy trail with skinny's,jumps,berms and speed all in one within 15 minutes from anyone in Memphis that wants to ride it!... That would be the shiznet for sure!

Re: Trail clearing this weekend Apr 9/10

PostPosted: Fri Apr 08, 2011 8:01 pm
by Jkinder
I'll be there Saturday to help the G-Unit go west. Those RIP boys are too rough for me.

Re: Trail clearing this weekend Apr 9/10

PostPosted: Fri Apr 08, 2011 8:07 pm
by dantheman
Brad C wrote:Dan, thanks for taking care of the bookkeeping on the WRT clearing.

Here that guys! Everyone remember to sign the papers,I'll drop some of at w.g. and i'll take some in just in case i miss you. Anyone at G-town I'll have some there too

Re: Trail clearing this weekend Apr 9/10

PostPosted: Fri Apr 08, 2011 9:02 pm
by Brad C
dantheman wrote:Understandable and good point,But would a 3' ride-over be an issue? If someone sues over that on a mtb trail then thats just stupid. Mtbing is an action sport. Would maybe some ride at your own risk signs at the entrances be an issue? How do other trails go about having obstacles? if there is clearly 2 ways to go and you choose to take the harder route and hurt yourself then that should be your own fault.Not a lawyer but theres gotta be a way to include every skill level,legally,in a trail system. Out of all the local trails we don't have hardly anything for the rider that enjoys riding obstacles or jumps,that needs to change. It doesn't even have to be WRT, I enjoy building and riding those kinds of stuff as well as alot of others, but there is nowhere to do it. I would happily go build anywhere I was given permission,and would fund my own projects with my own hard earned money,Just need the place.
After reading this I know what your gonna say,Brad,''Its not really a MTB trail'' so I rest my case. I have a dream that there can be an awesome,flowy trail with skinny's,jumps,berms and speed all in one within 15 minutes from anyone in Memphis that wants to ride it!... That would be the shiznet for sure!

You have a lot of good questions and points there Dan.

The first thing it takes is a partnership with the land manager. The best way of building in the various skill levels is the IMBA recommended series of interconnected loops. The loop closest to the trail entrance is the easiest loop that beginner and casual riders use. The next loop is of intermediate level of difficulty. The deepest loop is the expert loop which is the farthest from the trail entrance. Of course, each loop entrance has appropriate signage. Craighead Forest Park in Jonesboro has a variation of the 3 loop system and identifies the difficulty levels on the map. The WRT is a linear system so is not the best place to attempt this. Then a lot of it is state natural area. The Shelby Farms Park Conservancy is doing the MTB community a big favor in looking the other way on the written rules in the LBNA master plan. By the current written rules we should not be there.

We do have an agreement with Damon at Herb Parsons that we can build any obstacles we want as long as they are off of the main trails. Damon requested we keep the main trails open and clear for all users. Other than that, knock yourselves out. A lot of people think HP is just too far away.

The 3 feet above grade rule comes from our insurance company. Currently we pay $7 per member for basic coverage with trail design and building. At the last renewal we paid $686. That is quite reasonable. Your buddy with the indoor MTB park told me he is paying more than 10 times that amount. Our policy includes basic coverage for non-fee events, our bridges, and constructed obstacles up to 3 feet above grade. If we want to get more aggressive we could pay an additional $1.50 per member to go higher. MSTA would have to raise the member dues to keep our fixed expenses covered and have enough $$ to do projects.

That is where we are. To create an aggressive trail system it takes an MTB club and a land manager cooperating on the design and construction. That, as well as sharing the risks. Someone willing to do some research and get the details on how other sites handle this?

BTW, many people are quite envious of us in Memphis having ANY trails so close. We have WRT, TDW, and Stanky inside the city limits. Lakeland and Herbs are just a few miles away. There are many places where it is a 50 mile drive or more to get to a trail. We are quite lucky.